Response to Reader Comment

Recently, a reader of the blog responded to a post about a letter to the letter I submitted. Mr. Police Man, who runs a blog with the same name, wrote the following:

I don't mean this rude, as I understand where you are coming from, but why are you not fighting for more strict prosecution and greater sentences for the bad guys instead of going after the good guys trying to catch the bad guys for you?

That is what us on this side of the fense [sic] think. We are the guy running towards the bullets, putting our lives on the line at 10mph or 100mph. When does it ever come to the bad guy and his/her choice?

And let me state for the record that a stop sign, or speeding or broken tail light might not sound like all that important, but I've been doing this for 10 years and when I've been in a pursuit for those violations the suspect turned out to be a wanted murderer, car theft suspect, kidnapper, arson and many others. Do I go tell that family that I didn't chase the guy who just kidnapped their daughter, set her on fire and raped her because I wasn't 100% sure it was him driving the car that rolled through the stop sign? I hope this portrayes my frustrations. Take care and I look forward to more conversations.

Good post. I’d start out by pointing out that I certainly agree that there should be stronger penalties for those who flee the police. In my policy proposal for the Democratic nominee for Florida’s Governor Alex Sink I outlined a proposal to charge those who flee with at least a second degree felony instead of a 3rd degree. Our Mission Statement also argues that "fleeing and eluding should be a felony with mandatory prison time." If a fleeing criminal kills someone else I also argue they should be charged with murder, not manslaughter. After all, when you flee at dangerous speeds you know there is a very good chance you could hurt someone else.

We don't condone these poor decisions by who are usually young, dumb, males. However, we do believe that police should not compound bad decisions by criminals with risky behavior of their own. Of course this isn't saying that law enforcement doesn't have the best intentions. It just seems that sometimes law enforcement forgets that their job isn't to always catch the bad guys; rather it is to keep the public safe.

Next, you are right, a broken taillight might not sound like much but the suspect might be up to something much more serious. After all, when Ted Bundy was first arrested, he was pulled over for an invalid U-turn. He fled, police pursued and eventually arrested him. Unfortunately this in anecdotal evidence. Empirical evidence shows the most common crime committed, and assumed the reason for fleeing police, is that the car is stolen.

We simply believe that unless an occupant of the stolen vehicle has been suspected to have taken part in a violent crime that the dangers of pursuing for police officers and the innocent public do not make it worth it.

Reader responses… The negative

From time to time my inbox gets hit with an email that really lets me have it. Sometimes every bad word in the book is used in order to convey just how wrong we are, how little we know what it’s like "out there", and that we take the side of the bad guys. Some are well thought out with valid concerns and opinions. Those are cherished. Here is a sample of some of the comments I have received recently. Grammar has, for the most part, been corrected.

I could care less what happens to the suspect if they die or get injured so be it who cares it is their own fault. If police are to break off all pursuits because you liberal people believe the crime doesn't warrant a chase, what do you think is going happen? Suspects are going to start to realize that the police are not going to chase them, causing more people to disrespect the law and in fact put more innocent people in harms way...

We are not a bunch of liberals. We have support from citizens and officers representing many political backgrounds. Also, we contest that ‘restrictive’ policies will lead to a criminal free-for-all. We argue that there isn’t a portion of the population on the fence waiting for the department to release their latest policy; rather, people either pull over when asked, or don’t.

How about we try to teach people to stop running from the police that way we don't have any accidents from police chases.....there is a thought.

If this family wouldn't have run from the police then we wouldn't have had this accident now would we???

I agree, but I must ask, how do we do that? So should there be a fourth element to our recommendations? (Honest question, not sarcasm)

1) Proper training
2) Progressive Policy
3) Proper oversight
4) Proper public education?

You guys are stepping away from the problem by criticizing the suspects that "they shouldn't run from the police" but the aim of this site is to focus on safer techniques beyond that point:

Instead it’s people like you that helps make police pursuits more dangerous by focusing on the past then the future. I mean somebody has got to do it. You guys have this mental block that doesn’t let you go "out of the box" on the bad guys shouldn't run quotes I am glad you guys aren't part of my police department with your "trigger happy" attitude.

This one is all over the place, but can be summarized:

“Those who cannot learn from history are doomed to repeat it.” – George Santayana

I would like to take a few minutes to comment on some of the ideas I have read on this website. You mention that we as citizens depend on the police to make the decision as to when to pursue or not. Have you ever attempted to make a decision in a matter of seconds concerning a possible life or death situation? It's not as easy as all make it out to be. When the police pursue someone and an accident occurs, it is automatically assumed that the police are at fault. What happens when a police officer activates his blue lights, the violator flees at a high rate of speed, the police officer stops his attempts to take the violator into custody, and a mile down the road the violator hits and kills someone? Is it still the police officers fault that the accident occurred? I think not. However, everyday an agency gets sued for its officers doing just that. It's a catch 22 for police in this country. The public wants the police to protect them and at times give their lives for them. But when something happens that they don't necessarily like the public is the first to point fingers at law enforcement. Consider your wife or child is involved in an incident where a suspect strikes their vehicle and then attempts to leave the scene. Your family member is injured in the collision. There is a witness who calls the police and gives a description of the suspect vehicle. The police get behind it, blue light it, and the vehicle flees. The police cease all law enforcement action and resume normal patrol functions. Later that night your family member dies as a result of the injuries sustained in the hit and run accident. This is a circumstance where the hit and run is a misdemeanor in most states. Therefore, a pursuit is not warranted by most policies. Your family member is dead and there is no one to answer for the crime they committed which caused the death.

In most all instances the hands of the police are tied as to what they can do in given situations. This is no more apparent than in the police pursuit aspect of law enforcement. I do not agree that all violators should be pursued. A minor traffic offense does not add up to the dangers of pursuing a vehicle. However, the person driving the car with the broken taillight that flees might be the person who just killed 10 people at a mall just because he felt like it.

No one knows what the life of a police officer is like unless they have been one. People are quick to place blame on the police rather than the criminals they are chasing.

No, I have never had to make a decision in a matter of seconds concerning a possible life or death situation. You’re right, it isn’t easy. In fact, its difficulty is what justifies a progressive police policy. You are making my argument for me and I sincerely thank you.

You mention the case where a witness gives a description of a vehicle and suspect and the police attempt to pull it over but it flees. The police are restricted from chasing. That does not mean the suspect will get away. Through the description of the witness, the potential to obtain a license plate number, and various other methods, police can still catch the bad guy. In other words, just because the suspect leaves the sight of the pursing officer does not mean the suspect gets away with the crime!

You say the “person driving the car with the broken taillight that flees might be the person who just killed 10 people at a mall just because he felt like it.” I guess that is possible. But if you accept that statement, you must also accept that the person with the broken taillight that flees might be the stupid kid who doesn’t want his parents to be mad because he just got a ticket, right?

Again, you are right that no one knows what the life of a police officer is like unless they have been one. Much the same, no one knows what it is like to have an innocent family member killed as a result of a police pursuit.

Too bad when that same guy kills those two sisters after the police end the chase, everyone is still up in arms because now the police "ENDED IT TOO SOON".

Police can never seem to please the public who can sit back and "Monday morning quarterback" the whole situation. I would like to see the average citizen doing the extraordinary tasks that these officers do, the average citizen couldn't deal with the bloodshed and anguish that police officers deal with on a daily basis. They would go insane.

These officers feel bad enough already with someone telling them they screwed up, because guess what THEY ALREADY KNOW. They were already called into the police chiefs office and scolded, trust me I have been there.

We never doubt the sincerity of police officers unless certain evidence shows otherwise. Officers who are involved in a pursuit in which one of their own or an innocent victim is killed must live with that reality. It can’t be easy. However, just because it is a hard job does not mean we accept the status quo. It does not mean we simply say, well, “It’s part of the job.” It does not mean we don’t investigate, train, critique, and strive for perfection.

What is the job of a Police Officer? Well where to start. The jobs of a police officer is what it should say, considering that the "general public" expects them to be pretty much everything. It's their job to be a counselor, a teacher, a role model for children, a parent to the children that people don’t feel like raising, a preacher, a walking target, a trained fighter, a lawyer and plenty of other things. They have the jobs that no one in the world should have to have. They have the jobs that no one else wants. Chase a drunk driver and if they crash it's the officers fault, however 1800 people a year are killed by drunk drivers that are not being chased by officers. Chase an armed suspect and crash and it's the officers fault, however 10000 people a year are killed by people we are chasing to prevent them from killing again. Let's be realistic. If a police officer dies on duty it's part of the job, if a so called "innocent person" dies while police area chasing the bad guy, it's a tragedy. Police Pursuits are dangerous, and I wish they didn’t have to take place, but letting most people go so they can hurt someone else and get away with it. That's a lot more dangerous. Let me ask the real question, "Just what is the job of a citizen?" Of course I do mean other than to hate the police instead of the bad guys. I hope I answered your question, because it is in my opinion a question that no one in their right mind should ever ask.

This one is one of my favorites. In response to my query into the job of a police officer, this reader began by offering a true answer describing the sacrifices our officers make. Then it gets a bit odd. “Chase a drunk driver and if they crash it's the officers fault, however 1800 people a year are killed by drunk drivers that are not being chased by officers. Chase an armed suspect and crash and it's the officers fault, however 10000 people a year are killed by people we are chasing to prevent them from killing again.” I have no idea where the numbers are coming from, much less what they mean. According to MADD, over 16,000 Americans died in 2004 in alcohol related automobile crashes. Is he saying that of that 16,000, 1,800 were already asked to pull over by L.E. but refused, and later killed someone or themselves? Next, I have no idea what the talk of the 10,000 that are killed that we are trying to chase… Or something like that, means.

The writer continues, wondering why anyone with their right mind should ever ask such a question. Should I not care about the safety of those officers who put their life on the line every day? Should I not ask why Deputies Donta Manuel and Jonathan Wallace had to die? Should we just accept things as they are?

Your right, it's time to do a bit of research. Everyone knows that thousands of police departments and police officers don’t know as much as a guy who went to two low rate schools for a degree in Political Science. Oh yeah wait, every officer already has one of those degrees. Do some research is right, research how many "bad guys" go to jail because of police pursuits vs. how many "good guys" get hurt. Then research how many people the "bad guys" who get caught have hurt and then do the math. You may hurt 2000 people a year in pursuits, but you save about 20000 by getting those "bad guys" off the street. Research how many college students kill people in crashes a year...maybe they just shouldn’t be allowed to drive. Better yet research many training hours police officers have, like you said, then add in the hours a year they work, then add the drive time up and then OT, plus the school time and realize that they put over 3/4 of an average lifetime towards protecting jerks who will devote their lives to criticizing their every move, but will never have the guts to go out on the streets and do what the real "good guys" do.

And last but certainly not least, we have this one. It is in response to a question I asked regarding amount of time spent vehicle training in comparison to firearm training. It was rather rhetorical question considering all departments devote more training to firearms then to driving, but nonetheless. After sifting through the grammatical errors, I paused to take it in.

“Everyone knows that thousands of police departments and police officers don’t know as much as a guy who went to two low rate schools for a degree in Political Science.”

Thanks!

I find it interesting that this gentleman tells me to go do some research all the while throwing out all sorts of numbers with absolutely nothing to back them up. I can do that too. Actually, I’ll create a Mad Lib, and you can just go back and fill in whatever numbers make you happy!

Sure police pursuits hurt ______ people a year but if they don’t chase the bad guys then _____ more people will be brutally murdered! Also, if we don’t pursue everyone then _____ more banks will be robed and _____ more cars will be stolen and the world will dip into chaos and anarchy.

I’ve come to understand that this sort of reaction comes with the territory. I remember an email Jim Phillips received from an angry officer who said that if he was on duty and came across my father and his family in dire need, he would let us die. I imagine it is easy for that officer to say such things while hiding behind a keyboard, anonymous to the world. We, however, are putting our faces out there and attempting to make the streets safe for both citizens and law enforcement.

But a majority of comments are positive and reinforcing. More on those in the days to come.

An Email I Received

Below are a few excerpts from an email I received from a law enforcement officer:

Once a pursuit starts neither the suspect or the officer has much control over the outcome. Which is the most compelling reason why the use of police pursuits must be very limited. All pursuits are extremely dangerous. We have had a few instances over the years where officers attempted to stop a car and the driver fled and even though the officers chose not to pursue the suspect vehicle was still involved in an accident injuring an innocent party.

My agency has a very restrictive policy regarding police pursuits and while we debate provisions of the policy frequently with an eye toward improving the policy the majority of our officers do not disagree with the basic premise of the policy which strictly limits pursuits to those incidents involving a violent incident.

The officer makes a very important point. Mistakes happen when L.E. is not in control of the situation. By definition and by nature, police pursuits cannot be controlled to the point where safety can be assured. To continue:

I have been a police supervisor for twenty-five years (officer for 29 years) and currently I supervise a training squad. One of the points that I and the Field Training Officers emphasize about driving, whether it be pursuit, police, or personal, is how little control the driver really has over events external to their vehicle. We do this to encourage Officers in Training to recognize the dangers involved in driving and to learn to exert the maximum amount of control in those areas where they have the most impact.

I had the opportunity to review more of your site and I do agree that it is not a police bashing site. Your arguments are well formed.

I thank the officer for his email and support.